Zambini's Spell Development Thread

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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Shade »

What's the point, and how does that being a spell make sense?
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by woodmouse »

I think it'd be cool, although a bit weird and useless (unless there'd be some kind of power ups to it if you succeed a lot; you'd heal when doing it?) and probably could cause problems. :P
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Agent of Dread »

Too much TF2.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Maxaxle »

Agent of Dread wrote:Too much TF2.
I admit, it was "inspired" by the Dead Ringer.

And the idea is that you can sneak away from a boss-ish monster just as your HP is low, like in TF2 with heavies.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Shade »

Maxaxle wrote:And the idea is that you can sneak away from a boss-ish monster just as your HP is low, like in TF2 with heavies.
There's no point whatsoever in sneaking away from a boss, as most stages involve defeating the boss as one of the requirements to beating them. You can't defeat a boss by running away from it.

Running away to heal yourself is even more pointless, as simply pulling out a life potion and using it is leagues quicker, safer and more logical than "pretending to be dead and possibly failing".
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Agent of Dread »

A simple "Distract" spell (makes a monster run in a random direction at a random waypoint if successful) would work fine for a chance to get back, rebuff and heal.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Shade »

Agent of Dread wrote:A simple "Distract" spell (makes a monster run in a random direction at a random waypoint if successful) would work fine for a chance to get back, rebuff and heal.
Honestly, simply using a potion during the fight is still quicker than pulling out a spell and casting it is. I wouldn't want to waste one of my precious inventory slots for something like this, either.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by woodmouse »

Combining both ideas to a "distract by dead monster" spell? :lol: Although that'd be weird, summoning like a grub bug which then dies and if enemies are cobols/lumpkins/something, they'd go eat it?
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Maxaxle »

Still, Shade, I'm fairly certain we need something to distract level bosses with. Something to let the player take a breather, or at least use a health potion or two, before Leeroy Jenkinsing themselves to death.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Agent of Dread »

But the point is you can just use the potion on the run anyway. I suggested the distract spell to re-cast buffs and the like.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Shade »

@Maxaxle: We don't.
If really necessary, you can have another player distract the boss in multiplayer while you do your thing, as the AI tends to attack whomever it has last been hit by.
Of course, one could - and I do - argue, that if you get to the point where you need to run away from the boss, you already screwed up beyond repair. After all, why would you need to run away from it? Life potions take effect instantly. I don't see what's the problem with using them midfight - heck, if you really think it's gonna be that much trouble to pull them out of your inventory before using them, just keep them in one of your hands at all times. The game lets you do that, you know.
And, as I mentioned before, running away from a boss is utterly, totally completely point- and useless. Running away doesn't cause the boss to die, meaning that you can't beat the level. To the contrary, many bosses actually regenerate the damage you dealt to them before if you leave them alone.

Besides, if you have even the slightest idea what you're doing, most of the bosses not named Daemon Lord (well, unless you're really overpowered) or Dracolich can be reduced to dust in a mere few seconds.
Battles in Egoboo are not battles of attrition. You either kill your enemies quickly, or you die quickly. HP in this game generally are very low - for both the enemy and the player. Even healing (with items, at least) is something to avoid, as it permanently lowers your HP even further. So, in practice, you end up trying to beat most levels while taking at most two to four hits, depending on your class. The less you get hit, the better - it doesn't matter whether you're dodging a random cobol or a fearsome boss. You're already doing it wrong if you actually get hit in the first place. This is emphasized even more by the fact that a lot of enemies give you negative enchantments if they actually do hit you - the most common two being poison (hello, Sand Palace) and life drain (most of the stronger undead).

So, no, this is not a game a Leeroy Jenkins can play. He wouldn't even get past the Sand Palace. A tome that distracts a boss for absolutely no gain whatsoever wouldn't change anything about that at all.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Agent of Dread »

If you're calling getting hit doing it wrong, you're a Stop Having Fun Guy.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Shade »

Agent of Dread wrote:If you're calling getting hit doing it wrong, you're a Stop Having Fun Guy.
Why am I a Stop Having Fun Guy for pointing out something the game itself makes quite obvious? Sure, you can take a few hits. You're not a One Hit Point Wonder, like in Touhou for example. You can theoretically cheese your way through the earlier dungeons by carrying loads of life potions with you (if you can afford them in the first place). Thing is, that'll make the actually hard later dungeons even harder, 'cause by using potions and lowering your max. stats, you'll be capable of taking even less hits.

Egoboo is difficult. Unless you're the type that likes to level grind for ages, there's not much you can do about it.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Agent of Dread »

The game does not expect your perfectionism. The game expects that you'll occasionally be challenged, and probably killed too, until you learn how to overcome the game's many enemies and their strategies.
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Re: Zambini's Spell Development Thread

Post by Shade »

Where did I claim that Egoboo requires perfectionism? (Hint: Nowhere.)
Certainly you aren't going to argue that getting hit is doing it right, are you?
No, you've said it yourself - you'll often be killed. Unless you learn to minimize the amount of mistakes you make to where it doesn't kill you. Egoboo is lenient in this regard in that it allows you to take a few hits before failing the level, in that you can heal yourself if really necessary, and that you can even respawn if you die. That does not mean, however, that ramboing your way through the game is a valid way to play. It just doesn't work.
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