Zombi Starter much too hard?

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Zefz
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Post by Zefz »

Hmm... That might work. They would have to use the same stats model, etc. as Zombor himself though, since we can't use other specific object slots globally (except the spell book).
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Post by bgbirdsey »

We could implement the "spawn by name" feature, where we could spawn an object file based on a line in the messages.txt?

I imagine that the best way to do it would be to have a code to load up the model the 1st time that the object is spawned, and then a bit of code to search for the object by name when you want to spawn?
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Post by Zefz »

How much time does Egoboo use to load a object? It won't do any good to have sudden lags in the game due to new objects getting loaded into memory.

Or we could add even another new file in a objects folder that links to other objects that need to be loaded.

Whatever method we use, this would give scripters a new world of opportunity. A single spell or item could summon or morph into dozens of other objects.
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Post by bgbirdsey »

The idea of doing it in the IfSpawned part of the script would almost eliminate all of this since mose of the objects are actuallt sppawned before the module starts. It would be a dynamic way of doing what the spawn.txt file is doing.

If we would delay until the game starts, you are right that there would be a lag. That's why I proposed the two commands! :)

You are also right about using a spawn.txt file in the object folder, but that would be a bit cumbersome because what slot numbers would you use, and what happens if something in the spawn.txt file is using that slot???
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Post by Crispy »

Many good points there. The Zombi starter really isn't anything like itroduction of zombi game play. The startter suggests the idea of quantity over quality kind of class but currently the zombi is more like a butcher... I would say that the life steal skill should be taken off and something like summon related skill implemented, as suggested. Maybe a bit of additional HP regeneration could be added or increase the toughness of main zombi. One purchaseable armor perhaps. something like bandages so he would look like a mummy >_>
What could be a good amount of max summons then? should they be really weak, spawn from killed enemies and no maximum amount of summons or should they be like the two NPC players in adventurer starter but in this case they spawns with zombi to every module and can be resurrected using scroll of resurrection. or maybe something between these options. Like ability to resurrect slain enemies in general using scroll of resurrections. Is there many kind of zombies that can be summoned or are they always same kind? How many zombies can be summoned (from one corpse if corpses are used)? What is the method the zombi uses to summon, skill or item? Imo zombi could use his remaining life enrgy (max HP) to summon minions. max hp should be returned if minion dies or player quits the module. maybe there could be some new "skill books" (like spell books) that uses (max) hp instead of mana/energy.

oh my, if i don't quit now you will have to get a book vorsion of my thoughts...
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Post by unliketea »

you could perhaps steal from the minion master builds from guildwars.

minions are summoned from corpses. These minions slowly degen health over time, so you are constantly renewing your horde of minions.

a zombie, imho would have health regen .. therefore, implementing skills that would sacrifice a portion of his health to heal his zombies could be implemented.

my 2 cents. Cheers
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Post by octagon »

I think that the Zombi should get a bone or any other symbol for animating minions into the inventory automatically when he does something specific, like bumping a corpse, being unarmed in both hands, holding down a hand key when unarmed, grabbing thin air etc.... My idea is the following: The "bone", which actually is just a symbol, is removed when dropped, and if it's activated, it works like the Book of Animate or so, bu a bit faster. It depends on charging time if the minion will be a weak moron - then you can animate many - or a bruiser with un-nerfed AI, that needs many points to call.
I agree with unliketea's suggestion to make the minions drop their so called "health" points slowly to make them balanced.
And in general, I think that the Zombi should have a black bar for "animating points" needed to call minions. These points could either e.g. regenerate normally or by dealing damage (blaaack maaagick :evil:) or so... and you need 1 or 2 to create a stupid minion that acts like a Zombi animated by a Lvl 1 cobol that stole the WMAG skill from a helpless hero (no, not animated by a Cobol Mage... that would already be too good...) [btw: a skill stealing character type could be really nice...], 3-4 for a semi-useful one, 5-6 for a really good Zombi and even much more for one as useful as the allies from the Adventurer Starter. But there should be a cap for minion points investible into a single minion, because minion zombis with 40HP and as strong as a Hellrover wouldn't be a good idea for balancing.
BTW: The zombor should be able to call minions from the beginning, but only have 3-5 starting points for animating, so that he can just call a few lamo-zombis or a single average one.
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Post by Zefz »

bgbirdsey wrote:You are also right about using a spawn.txt file in the object folder, but that would be a bit cumbersome because what slot numbers would you use, and what happens if something in the spawn.txt file is using that slot???


Sounds like something like a HashMap would be useful here so that we could reference objects by name rather than slot number.

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About the Zombi class: Any Humanoid killed by Zombor turns into a lesser Zombi helper? (max helpers = Zombor level). Maybe only enemies who were killed by unarmed attack rise as Zombi's? We could either implement a life timer (30 seconds) and/or reduce their health over time. (maybe they steal life when attacking, increasing their current life time?)

Increasing Zombi helper power by level should be easy to do. I think this idea would be possible to implement with the current scripting system using the player model and a third skin. (and special AI states)
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Post by Cimeries »

It would work story-wise if we say Zombor has been with his master for so long that some of his dark magic rubbed off on him.
:wink:
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Post by Crispy »

This topic and a question popped to my mind when I was playing crypt... if the zombie were to actually spawn minions from slain monster, how would he be able to complete crypt since there is only Ulnas (skeletons, already puppets/summons) and Trenches (mere bugs). Neither of those could IMO logically be used as potential summoning material... infact, if I think it logically only humans can become something like zombies and there isn't any humans in most of the mudules. How about making a new scroll that spawns human corpses when used? Or just instead of zombi minions make it possible to revive the slain monsters in the same form they were but with a bit lower stats. Like Diablo II necromancer "Revive" -skill. Nah, that doesn't even sound funny anymore >_>
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Post by Zefz »

I mentioned Humaniods only above. This includes, but is not limited to:
- Cobols
- Lumpkins
- Jungle Warriors
- Bandits
- Humans
- Elves
- Minotores
- Torcs
- Warlocks (but they leave no body)

Zombor would have a hard time in the Catacombs and Abyss. Hopefully he would have gained enough power by then to depend on himself. He can become the ultimate warrior at higher levels with the best attack speed in the game (2 attacks per second or so with a Sword).
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Post by unliketea »

the guildwars way of increasing zone applicability was to say minions could be raise from "fleshy" corpses ... so the bugs would work, but obviously, not the skeles
Cimeries
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Post by Cimeries »

Zombugs?
:wink:
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Post by unliketea »

meh ... you can glue flesh together whatever way you want to provided the owner of the flesh doesn't mind.
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Post by Agent of Dread »

I still don't really like the idea of Zombor summoning things. :/
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